A highly skilled woodworker, teacher, draughtsman and writer has said the following about me on several occasions, according to his students.
“You shouldn’t listen to Schwarz. He’s never been a professional woodworker.”
He’s 100-percent correct, of course. I spent one summer building entryway doors for Therma-Tru. A second summer I built folding particleboard tables. And I did 14 years building furniture infrequently for Popular Woodworking magazine. But I would never ever call myself a professional furniture maker.
I am, like many of you, a frustrated amateur furniture maker. Since 1993, I have spent every waking moment trying to perfect my skills. I have taken classes, read every book I thought was worth reading and happily soaked up every bit of wisdom I could find from woodworkers alive and dead.
I struggle every day that I am in the shop, which is just about every day. I mess stuff up. I design some pieces that are awkward, which I would never show in public. I mis-cut joints, curse my hands and wish I were as confident as Frank Klausz.
If I had to put a resume together today, the only real skills I’d list are an insatiable curiosity for our craft and the ability to string together words in a way that upsets some people. Oh, and I am one of the founding members of the Radio Shack Battery Club.
So why am I pulling my pants down on the Internet and not even asking you for a credit card number? Because I want you to know that there are very few (if any) woodworking gods. Yes, there are some people who are savants at a particular joint or process, but anyone who thinks he has mastered the craft should study 40 more years and get back to us.
Woodworking is hard. For everyone. And if you love the craft as much as I love the Radio Shack Battery Club, then you will never ever be satisfied with your work. Something in every project – a joint, a reveal, a quirk – can always be improved.
So why do I teach? That seems like uber-hubris.
Wow. That’s a good question. I teach only because people ask me to teach. I’ve never called a school asking to teach there. I teach because there are always people who know less than I do (incredible though it seems). And I teach because I have met some of my best, lifelong friends in classes, including John Hoffman, my business partner in Lost Art Press.
So I agree with the guy who says you shouldn’t listen to me because I’m not a professional. But perhaps I am a somewhat useful ugly bag of mostly water because I am an amateur.
I am no different than the goofy guy next to you at the bench in the last woodworking class you took. Except that guy… whew… he really smells.
— Christopher Schwarz
Very well put Chris! Thanks for pulling your pants down. Wait that didn’t come out right. 🙂
“Wait that didn’t come out right.”
Neither did that! (c;
I didn’t know that “being a professional woodworker” was a requirement. I thought it was about having some particular skill to share. If you were offering advice or classes on running a woodworking business then maybe he has a point.
I do know that reading ATC screwed up my life. I got a bad case of plane-itis, and it developed into an acute case of saw nest lust. I had to make a tool chest for my son for Christmas, and had to drag home several large timbers that I’m coaxing into being a Rouboish bench.
Plus, aren’t most of us in this because we like it? Not because we think we can make a lot of money as a ‘professional’.
Exactly. I don’t want to be a professional furniture maker. I want to make stuff that I want to make. For enjoyment.
I do need to find a 12 step group to deal with my hand tool obsession though.
You may not be a ‘professional’ woodworker, and I don’t think you are a member of the “oldest profession in the world”, but (please) keep those cards and letters coming . . . for the rest of us unprofessionals!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I agree, I won’t listen to you, however as you are a professional writer, I will continue to read your blog, pant down and all……
I read another article once that stated that being called an amatuer woodworker is a compliment, as generally an amatuer has the time to research and cut joints that will last, a professional is generally constrained by price/time so shortcuts need to be made.
My money is on Underhill….
Underhill? As the person who said those things? Not a chance.
Well, what you call yourself, or whatever anyone else calls you, I’m certainly glad you do what you do.
You’ve helped me a ton and I appreciate it.
(now pull your pants back up, will ya?)
Being a leading professional in any field and being able to teach in that field are two completely different things. It’s quite rare to fine someone that has the combination of both. So when someone says, “You shouldn’t listen to Schwarz. He’s never been a professional woodworker,” it does not necessarily follow that “You should listen to me, because I am.”
Christopher,
I present merely a datapoint: Since your writing inspired me, I have learned to flatten and true boards by hand, create edges at a crisp 90 degrees to their faces, to measure and mark accurately, to choose the appropriate class of saw cut, and to let the saw do the work. I’ve learned to chop only half of the work at a time until reaching the mark with my chisel, and I have learned to sharpen and camber my plane irons, and to do this frequently. I’ve learned to sharpen again before asking other questions. I’ve learned to use a bench hook (which you taught me to make), a shooting board, and you taught me how to keep my metal plow plane’s depth stop from slipping. I’ve learned what adding a shallow rabbet can for a dovetail joint, and I have learned that I need to make many more practice dovetail joints before I go into “production” mode. I have learned that I should see what Moxon, Wearing, and Anonymous have to say about woodworking. I have learned to choose appropriate music for the shop.
I have not taken a single class with you, so I cannot properly address your skills as a workshop instructor… BUT:
Your writing has somehow given me the courage and inspiration I needed to teach myself. All of the above happened via trial and error, using my own senses and mind, with no teacher present… but I would not have done it if you had not written what you do, and in the way you do it.
For that I will always be thankful, and no matter what your furniture is like (although I assume its pretty great), I will always consider you one of my favorite teachers.
Speaking of Frank Klausz, I heard this Q& A at WIA.
Q: “Why do you use a pencil and not a marking knife?”
A: “Because I’m Frank Klausz. Frank Klausz uses a pencil.”
You can’t argue with that logic.
Jonathan
====================
In a similar vein, I overheard a well-known metal shaper respond to the question “how thin can you gas weld aluminum?”, to which he responded “how thin can I weld it, or how thin can YOU weld it?”
wow – Radio Shack Battery Club (I too was a founding member) and original Star Trek reference in one post – he may not be a “professional woodworker” but boy he CAN string words together though!!
I’ve heard advice like this a few times, about you and others. I listen to you sometimes precisely *because* you’re not a professional woodworker. For at least two reasons –
1) *I’m* not a professional woodworker. So I’m not always looking for the way a professional does things. Just like when I built electric guitars as a hobby, I didn’t look to how Gibson, or even a small professional luthier did things. There will quite often be a difference in methods between how a person making their living and a person living their making will approach something. One isn’t always better than the other, and I’m approaching this craft for the love of it. I have no doubt I could love living by it, but without those concerns, I’m in it for a different reason, hence different methods.
2) A professional isn’t going to have the time or tenacity to do some of the things you’ve done. A professional isn’t going to be a fellow that’s built what are you at now, a dozen types of workbenches? A professional needs to get to making a living, and will buy something, deal with it’s quirks, kludge together fixes and make it work. After 30 years, it’ll be modified and unrecognizable for what it once was. But they don’t have time to experiment with the intricacies of different forms and workholding. Yes, we captured in over-thinking sometimes, but if you’re in the craft for some fun, it’s nice to be able to take the time to at least think about what’s going to be the most useful and fun for how you work. And being a non-professional, you’re working closer to how I work, (or would like to work.) Is a professional going to care about how his workbench holds pieces for edge jointing? No, a professional has a jointer that’s probably bigger and more expensive than I could ever fit in my “shop” to do that job quicker so he can get back to doing the types of handwork that put bread on the table.
I don’t mean this as an affront to the professionals of the world – I have the utmost respect for anyone that can make a living at the craft, particularly in this day and age. And I probably have the utmost to learn from them as well; but I don’t want to deal with trying to make a living at woodworking, and because of that I can avoid a lot of the ways they work, because they aren’t fun to me. So someone who’s a professional amateur speaks more directly to what I want to get out of woodworking.
That said, anyone who holds you (or Roy, or Krenov, or anyone else) up too high on a pedestal gets on my nerve too – I guess I just don’t like pedestals.
I have been a pro woodworker for 30 years and have to say your books and articles, have helped me to be a better woodworker.I know this profession is a life long journey,you will never stop learning.
“living their making” – J. Pierce
I love that statement.
Chris,
Despite enjoying every conversation I’ve had with you I was never interested in taking a class from you…until now.
Just keep doing what you are doing. There’s always someone looking to throw poo against the wall.
Nice Star Trek reference by the way.
Chris, I was reading again chapter 20 of your book last night – that bit about the duty of … “amateurs to pick up the mantle of the craft of woodworking from the professionals, who have been carrying this heavy burden for us for generation after generation ” … in order to keep the woodworking hand skills, techniques and knowledge alive. The professionals have been doing it for a long time but are continuing to fade in the face of the consumers’ thirst for cheap imports and throw-away furniture awaiting disposal in the next cosmetic “makeover” trend.
Be encouraged. You are not alone in your call. As a professional woodworker who began in the industry using only nail guns, machinery and power tools, I was fortunate as a baby-boomer to have had a childhood and school background using hand tools. These early skills and knowledge remained unused for a long time. However the last 20 years has seen me increasingly valuing and using those hand tools skills and techinques. My father started his apprenticeship in 1945 as a carpenter/joiner. My hunger to learn from his wealth of knowledge and skills has grown increasingly over the last two decades. I am very fortunate to have learned so much from him over the years – but first I had to be ready to listen to him and ask him the questions. Over the last few years, Chris, you have also been a significant source of encouragement and knowledge on my hand tool rennaisance journey as a professional.
I now use hand skills in my work more than ever before, supplemented with machine use. My nail guns are rarely used. I don’t try to compete with K-Mart, Ikea or China. I love my craft more than ever, and am the most highly skilled now that I have ever been. I still make custom furniture, but I now also teach woodworking handskills to anyone who wants to learn – and this includes going into primary schools, high schools, community centres, birthday parties, and shed gatherings. Anyone aged from 4 to 104. I love to pass on the joy of wood and hand tool woodworking.
Here is the good news. There is a growing groundswell of people here in the Australian community who want to do things for themselves, who want to recycle an re-use wood rather than see it dumped into landfill, who want to resist the consumeristic lust for accumulating cheap crap, and who want to experience the joy of interacting with wood in a way that you can feel, smell, and hear. It’s small, but growing by the day…
You may be an amateur, and proud of it, but you are out there waving a flag with many people following in their own (anarchistic) ways. That “highly skilled woodworker, teacher, draughstman and writer” is correct that you have never been a professional. But is he very very wrong when it comes to the “don’t listen to Schwarz” bit. Keep raving on, Chris.
… I am not alone in listening with all ears…
Regards,
Greg.
http://www.gregdmiller.blogspot.com
Reminds me of the saying “those that can’t, teach”. Well, I’m not very fond of that expression and actually take offense. When I look back at all the great teachers I’ve had, whether in school or in life I have a true sense of gratitude. Where would I be if it weren’t for all the folks who are dedicated to sharing knowledge on a given subject.
So Chris, thank you for raising the bar on history and on woodworking, and for reminding us that you too are human!
OK, you’re not a professional woodworker, but that doesn’t mean that you cannot teach. By reading your stuff, plus the writings of a few others, I have learned how to design (sort-of) and build a workbench…which I love…and from you exclusively, two saw benches…using hand tools. In the process I have learned a BUNCH of new skills that I thought I could never possess. And I could also point out any number of things in those projects that need improvement.
I don’t always agree with you, but I always pay attention. The ability to keep the attention of the audience is a very necessary skill in a good teacher, as is the ability to encourage the class to think for themselves.
You do both.
Please continue.
And the nice thing about writing vs. classroom teaching is that you can write sans pants and nobody cares.
Geez. The one thing I -don’t- miss learning from you every day is Star Trek lines. Oh — and Talledega Nights lines. So two things.
And ruthless efficiency.
The three things Megan doesn’t miss learning from you every day are Star Trek lines, Talledega Nights lines, and ruthless efficiency… and an almost fanatical devotion to Roy Underhill.
Megan’s *four*… no… *Amongst* our, er, her, list of things she doesn’t miss learning… are such lines as those from… I’ll come again.
Hm, she is made of harder stuff. Cardinal Fang, fetch…The Comfy Chair!
snort
What I find out about myself when I am designing and building a piece of furniture is more valuable than anything else that I have ever learned. Woodworking is a craft and an art. I would guess that there are a lot of artist and craftsmen that are away striving for perfection. I have to remind myself and sometimes tell other that I know a guy who is perfect…. That is ONE guy and the guy is not me. So, I will keep trying, keep laughing at my mistakes and look forward to the journey as i go through the process.
Beside Chris I remember what Momma said…Son, if you don’t have something nice to say…
I think we can figure the rest.
It’s true that you’re not a professional woodworker. I suppose you’ll never be like the professional woodworkers who build particle board cabinets and IKEA furniture day in and day out. Sheesh, do you think this individual has a narrow focus or what?
i have taken a class from you and you do not smell any “worser” than the rest of the class…i have have had a beer(or 3) with you, and you impressed my wife(who is my ultimate measuring stick), but you are one helluva teacher…….professional or not matters not……..
be well
peace
dale
I’m new to the writings of Christopher Schwarz, I’m a little ways through Anarchist’s Tool Chest and not only love your writing style but also the unpretentious voice you bring to the subject of hand tools. As someone who is trying to make a living building furniture, I’m listening and I’m going to keep listening. Please keep it coming.
Maybe the beauty is you are not a professional. You are open to research how lots of people do things and manage to decelopman approach we non professionals feel we should be able to do also.
I am glad, i think, that I did not see the pants down bit. lol
Don’t sweat it Schwarzy. Professionals are focused on production so their focus is normally not on hand tools. With an eye on profit margin they are looking at machine tools to maximise throughput. The craft of hand tools is more likely to be sustained by amateurs who are doing it for love and experience. And we need people to pass on the knowledge. People who share the same passion as we do, and can help figure out the gnarl of forgotten traditions and techniques of handtools. I’ll take Schwarz’ enthusiasm over professional arrogance any day.
About a year ago I took a veneering class which was taught by Terry Moore, one of New Hampshire’s Furniture Masters. Terry (who has a humility that comes at least in part from being largely self-taught) is truly a master of veneering. During the class, he said (and I quote roughly – my apologies, Terry, for not having written down the exact words):
“Better to pursue your craft with a passion and little experience, rather than with much knowledge and little passion.”
Chris,
You bring a passion for woodworking coupled with a willingness to do research, dive in, and try things in order to gain experience that is so refreshing! (Not to mention the fact that you seem to have an uncanny ability to communicate your passion, trials, and successes!) I, too, say “Please continue.”
I am a professional woodworker (but hardly a master – the master can fully support himself with his craft, something I have not had the opportunity to do), but I keep the following quote from the Apostle Paul over my workbench as a reminder:
“Always consider others better than yourself.” Philippians 2:3.
If I always consider others better than myself, then I will have the opportunity to learn from anyone whether master or amateur, and continue to improve as a woodworker. The alternative would be to claim that I am the best (which I know all too well I am not) and in so doing, forgo the opportunity to learn from others and continue moving ahead. Thanks for helping us all to “move ahead” in our woodworking! – It matters little to me if you are professional or amateur so long as you continue what you are doing.
I occasionally run across some criticism of Chris or something he’s said. Perhaps some of it is occasionally valid from a certain perspective. I usually find these sort of comments to be taking things out of context but many are tinged with an obvious streak of jealousy or are just plain rubbish. I don’t get it though. I made a false start into this whole hand tool thing back in the 80s. There was no Schwarz and no internet then but there were people publishing books and retailers selling strange looking tools out of catalogs like spokeshaves and some really really expensive stuff from Europe that makes a #8 jointer from Maine today look quite reasonable. The thing is that none of those people around then made nearly so big an impact on this little hobby of ours as Chris has. His writing brought me back into the game and I’ve never owned so many woodworking tools as now, both electrically and calorie driven. I won’t even mention the books and publications I’ve bought in the past few years. I know my local WoodCraft and Rockler stores are happy about that. You’d think anyone involved in woodworking today would be happy to see Chris on the scene, whether they sell tools, new or used, publish or write books or magazines or even just like to see the number of hits on their blog grow. Most, I’m quite sure, are. Anyone who really believes that Chris is a woodworking God is in good hands and will eventually come to understand there are other ways and points of view. And that’s okay. I have a suspicion who the highly skilled woodworker, teacher, draftsmanship and writer is. I really hope I’m wrong because that kind of comment is petty, undignified and I really like what he has to offer too. Whoever it was though, grow up and let your work speak for itself. I make it a rule to never bash the competitors in my field. Chris, keep doing what you’re doing. For my part, I’m thrilled there’s someone out there like you who’s taken the time to ask the questions and dig up the past. How many of us ever heard of Roubo before you came along? You may not be a woodworking God, but you’re one hell of a prophet.
Well said Mark. I’ll listen respectfully, and consider carefully, all points of view on a topic if they are coherent and reasoned. But anyone, whatever their public reputation, that can’t present their case without personal insults and snarky asides loses my respect and any future attention.
Push on Chris. I reach my own conclusions but you make me think. That’s the highest compliment I give any human being.
Bob
Good article and well written Chris. Make me feel a whole lot better!! And Marc was right, that didn’t sound right, so can you pull your pants up now??
I like what you teach, but I do not think that you are the only candle in the room. I worry that many woodworkers are unlikely to look beyond what the “Schwarz” has said. I think that too often we narrow our scope to one persons view point. With that said, keep up the good work.
That’s hardly something to lay at Chris’s feet though. And based on what I read on forums, I don’t think you really have much to worry about. 🙂
I would never discount someone just because they’re not a “pro”. That’s just plain nonsense. Hell, just look at all the exhibits at the shows, most of those are amateurs, working for the love of the craft, not for a paycheck.
As others have pointed out, the methods appropriate for an amateur are likely much different that those for a production shop. I don’t have gobs of 220V service, floor space to spare and deadlines to meet. I have a little basement shop, kids sleeping upstairs and all the spare time I can scrounge up. I think the methods and tools you push are more appropriate to that setting, my setting, and that is why I keep reading and following and writing myself.
I think Chris is totally wrong, here. While he might not be a professional furniture maker, I definitely think that by now he qualifies as a professional woodworker. I know that anybody that has written as much, taught as much and done as much for the hobby/ craft/ profession as he has, is without question, a professional. Other than that, I agree with everyone else and would like to once again thank you Chris for all that you have done, currently do and will continue to do. We are all better for it. Now if I can just find an opening in one of your classes.
Pro calibre; amateur standing. Does that about sum it up?
Chris’ books, blog and his hand tools / hand planes class have allowed me to peek behind the curtain of this craft / art / way of life. The path isn’t easy, inexpensive or quick. However, I find it immensely satisfying. On January 2, I completed my 17 month journey of blood, sweat and tears that resulted in my first piece of furniture (a maple and cherry bed). I learned an amazing amount about furniture building and myself during the process. I’ll make mistakes in my upcoming projects, but now they will not paralyze me. This quotation / paraphrase from him helped my greatly. “Everybody has a certain number of bad dovetails in them. You have to keep making them until you’ve got them out of you.” This is excellent council from a wise teacher.
Chris is an inspirational and ethical teacher who gives away much of his time and expertise in an effort to preserve the craft and help others. I’m glad he isn’t a “professional” woodworker because a full time professional woodworker wouldn’t have the time / energy to research, experiment, write and teach at the level he does. I believe he is right where he is supposed to be.
I’m glad he isn’t a “professional” woodworker because a full time professional woodworker wouldn’t have the time / energy to research, experiment, write and teach at the level he does. I believe he is right where he is supposed to be.
Well Said.
Krenov always held that the future of the craft was with the amateur, not the professional.
With amateurs like you, who needs professionals?
Amateurs of the world, unite and take over!
Dang, I think you’ve set a record with replies! I don’t know who actually has read those remarks about, but I did. He just didn’t read ATC real thorough did he.
We are the same age and my shop is my porch (sound familiar). I also have a couple of girls. Are you focusing on your family like you said? Glad you have so far. Glad you set the record straight. I can’t add to what already has been said. You’ve set your course, now “engage Mr Sulu”
What a grump, but it makes a lot of sense. Want to be a pro? Learn from a successful pro. Want to have fun? Learn from someone who has a lot of fun.
I have fun using my Roubo bench and Moxon twin screw vise to build projects from the Joiner and Cabinet Maker, and I think I’m not the only one…
Thats alot think about,After many years in tool shops with so many time tables it’s hard to think of either pro.or amateur. now I just try to think of my shop as a maintenance shop that needs a few new goodies just to keep up.You never know what might break or need to be replaced. Not so much pressure there. I just like my domain.
I’ve found that placing a freshly cut block of cedar near the end of the bench I’m at, that is closest to that guy, does wonders at masking the odors wafting across the room. And nobody gets their feelings hurt. Now if I can just figure out why the guy on the other side of me has that cedar stump sitting on his bench. Heck I thought we were supposed to be using green oak. (c=
Good for you Chris!! That is what it’s all about! do it for the love of doing it!
Cheers
David
The skill you display in creating a blog post designed to elicit a particular response from your readers is both polished and extremely well thought out, even if by chance you did not think it out on purpose. It’s particularly a neat turn of phrase to take a quote out of context without allowing the unknown person quoted to include a response and to use that quote as the basis for your statements to support your reasoning.
You succeeded in turning phrases such as “woodworking gods” and words such as ‘professionals” into epithets thrown at you by unidentified people, thus eliciting supportive responses from your readers. Within one blog post, you’ve pulled your readership hard to your side, created a new order of the ‘me against the Man’ scenario that further supports your Social Anarchy philosophy. You’ve quite successfully painted yourself as the reluctant leader and teacher of the amateurs who, beset by the patronizing professionals, need your tutelage and direction to bring sense and order to your audience despite the machinations of those professionals.
“I teach only because people ask me to teach. I’ve never called a school asking to teach there. I teach because there are always people who know less than I do (incredible though it seems).” Written as if it is a wry statement, yet holding an element of true feeling buried deep within. There is no greater hubris apparent in these phrases than in any I’ve read in many a day.
I’ve a sense this entire blog post was built around your desire to make this statement along with a chance to stick it to the “professional” who had the temerity to insult you to his students.
The ability to create a tempest from the steam of a teacup is social engineering at it’s finest. The ability to say what you want to say without partaking of social engineering is called honesty and in this post, Chris, I’m sorry to say you’ve allowed hubris to overshadow your soul.
Gee
Gary finds it necessary to be the only negative comment here.
What a surprise.
The struck dog barks the loudest?
Raney, I wouldn’t dream of letting you down. Public discourse is, after all, what it’s all about, isn’t it?
Gary,
I am not one of the Schwarzbots that feels the need to mindlessly defend Chris where ever he is criticized. However, your post is saturated with judgements of Chris’ motivation and intent, which is something that you can not possibly know unless you are very close to him. If you desire to retain your credibility, I would suggest focusing your criticisms on the content of what he writes and does and not on what you believe to be the inclinations of his heart.
Somebody needs a nap.
Gary,
I am not a “Schwarzbot” either, as someone very eloquently put above.
One question I ask myself after reading such a long rant as you have posted is:
“What the fu@# do you care?”
Seriously, you rant on an on about manipulation (implied) and hubris… maybe take a close look in a mirror. It’s ironic that you make this statement on the author’s own blog, that they own and populate, and is their’s to do as they wish. Who is trying to “stick it to the ‘professional'” now?
Granted, maybe you are just jealous of his success and notoriety. I think this is probably closer to the mark given the fact that you have your own blog and your own press/book company. You might even feel threatened. Keep in mind the old phrase that “a rising tide raises (floats?) all ships” (or something to that effect). His success and outreach can add to and feed yours.
Unless, of course, you keep spouting off publicly like a condescending prick. That’s not the way to gain friends or business. (You’ve lost mine before even gaining it.)
In answer, the comment was quite harsh and for that I apologize. Yet, it was honest in content and for that, whether it is on my own blog or on anothers , I’ll always speak honestly. Just as any are welcome to comment as you will on my blog.
For clarity, I sell to an entirely different market than does Chris. Unlike LAP, I don’t publish to make a living, I publish to keep select titles in print and to support my book buying habit as well as the cost of maintaining websites.
There is no competition there, there hasn’t been any and I don’t foresee any. Even if another publisher were to print the same title, it’s free trade and that’s publishing.
It is easy to understand why my comment, detracting and taken as personal, would produce intense responses. But let’s be honest here. Chris wrote in a personal vein, not in a philosophical abstraction. Thus, my response in kind. This is a public blog and that’s what happens. I know of whom he writes and of the background story.. Offering a quote out of context and unattributed is bad form and that was my point.
In publishing, blog, website, hard print or airwaves, you put out your thoughts and you take your lumps. Chris does and so do I.
I’ve seen some of the poo slinging. As exhausted as I am by it, I can only imagine how you experience it.
The real test for me has always been the progress I’ve made over the years thanks to your work. As just the latest example, in the five months since I read ATC, I’ve learned to joint with my jack plane well enough – and quickly enough – that I rarely turn on my 6″ jointer. I’ve given up my RAS in favor of cross cutting by hand (and reclaimed the space), and the moving fillester I picked up last fall is a treat. My shop is all the more functional for the effort, less expensive to operate, and healthier for my lungs and hearing. Best of all, it’s a more appealing and accessible craft for my son, whose insatiable curiosity is soaking up your lessons as quickly as I can internalize them.
Thank you, Chris. Keep writing and teaching. If I’m lucky, I’ll get a chance to take one of your classes some day.
Chris, don’t apologize, just keep on doing your thing.
So what they are saying is there is something in common with Chris Schwarz and Charles Darwin, Michael Faraday, Thomas Edison, Guglielmo Marconi, etc., etc.
woodworking is a deeply spiritual practice for me and for many professionals in the field my views really would be coming from another world, but it’s a better world. My heart belongs to world that does not need affluence to preserve forms of art and craft that might be dwindling and the work of my hands is not a response to the authorities or market trends in a field. I have never bought a piece of wood, everything I have worked with has been discarded by some one who bought it from a professional. I believe Marshal McLuhan is correct, the medium is the message. I learn everything I can from every experience and every teacher and I learned a lesson from Lewis Kahn…ask the wood what it wants. It is time for the anarchists to march into the temples and kick over the tables of the money changers…of course they will want to crucify you.
Crikey! The amateur/professional thing is irrelevant – it’s what you say, write and do which I value, and how you do all that.
I come to know about your blog post by Facebook. It’s sound interesting to know that… I am very eager to know about Furniture and making style. Because, I want to start one blog section on my website. I am quite out of subject but, want to know more about furniture making style.
Obviously if you make money doing something, you are an expert and if you don’t, you can’t possibly know anything of importance. Oh, and also the more money you make (at the craft), the more expertise you will have and the better teacher you will be.
The ones that say “what has he ever done” will also have difficulty with us mere mortals as we struggle through the process of learning woodworking, and won’t be able to understand why we can’t do what they tell us to do.
I am reminded that Ted Williams was a lousy manager and batting instructor for that very reason. This is a baseball reference Chris, so ask one of your sporting friends.
I have taken many classes, and a few with you as well. I have learned some in each one of them, that has helped me grow as a woodworker.
So I guess the answer to “what has he ever done”, should be “taught many people to be better woodworkers than I am”, which will be hard for the master craftsman to state.
Rick
One consequence of the revival of furniture anarchy… the potential loss of demand for “professional” production and “professional” teaching. He could be voicing a perceived threat to his livelihood. My anarchist brain is conditioned to discount establishment admonitions of this sort.
We individuals are evidently creating enough of a monetary and educational demand for Chris as to engender “elitist” resentment for his notoriety. As an un-credentialed amateur anarchist, I take their unwarranted shots as a compliment.
Yeah, I was right about the source of the comment and I’m extremely disappointed. Jealousy is a part of human nature and I get that. I thought the author of the criticism had, as he put it, posted his last response, on his own site but I suppose he gets something from continuing the petty sniping. To him I’d say, no, you haven’t had the impact Chris has had but you have made a difference. I have a number of your products and I’m glad to have them. You’ve cast your accusations and Chris has answered them more than adequately. If it’s more light you desire in your own corner, follow the lead and focus on woodworking and what you do best. I’ve found that part of your repertoire to be well worthwhile. If it’s mud slinging I want, there’s plenty of that in the political arena.
Really liked the quote from Star Trek: The Next Generation.
Also glad to hear I am not the only less than perfect woodworker.
I hear what Gary is saying, but that’s the beauty of the blog and social media. Get a stinkbomb in all that gushy stuff – and this comment post will last weeks! So I will write my comment to the responders…
I for one, enjoy reading from Chris that clearly likes to write and is humble with a sense of humor. He would have lost me a long time ago if not for his style of writing. I would say that is a teacher. Never occurred to me to consider if he were a professional furniture maker. Seems almost silly. The person that is quoted sounds like he is missing part of the picture – or defensive anyway.
I am just now finishing up The Anarchists Tool Chest. I am reading it at a time when my own constant organization of life seems never ending. The tool chest is great and all that – but it’s the philosophy behind it that I admire and can’t help apply to my shop life, art, drawers, cupboards, Tupperware… it’s a splintery cleanse!
Dear Gary – take it for what its worth man. And thanks Chris for presenting…uh er – not the pants down thing.
In college I suffered through many classes with professors who may have been excellent scientists, but they couldn’t teach worth a lick. Some of those classes were saved by teaching assistants who were good teachers. Some, not so much. One lesson I learned from that was that in any endeavor which includes communicating something to others, it will be limited by the communication skill. I haven’t taken one of your classes and can’t comment on that. But I think Chris, that regardless of your woodworking skill or experience, your work wins on the strength of your writing (and presumably your speaking).
So please, pull those pants up.
I think there are a number of unfortunate paradox at work in this thread, cultural political and economic to name a few. It is unfortunate those who make a good living from a craft might be threatened or resent another view or insight into that craft? It would imply that there are motivations other than a love of the craft. But from a logistic stan point, in the context of market conditions the quote might have been offered with the best of intentions. I might even understand a little resentment from a craftsman barely making ends meet by plying his trade in honesty, while another type of craftsman (a crafter of words as well as wood) can afford a higher profile work and lifestyle by marketing (rather than working) a notion of do it yourself that is of course popular with a novice. The problems arise out of a referential totality that can not be resolved by any sort of one-up-man-ship. The whole thing must be reborn in a new world where the responsibility of freedom are at work in our cultures and technology.
“…and wish I were as confident as Frank Klausz.”
Good God… THAT kind of power? In the hands of an amateur??
In a world choked in institutions and their expectations, it’s not surprising to find some threatened by individuals who excel outside of those boundaries. What I take away from all of this is that the student/teacher relationship is a mutual exchange in its purest form. At times the master becomes the novice and the novice becomes the master. We experience this role-exchange daily and think little of its educational character, but it’s is how we learn.
The institutional approach understandably is jealous of its distinctions and rigid roles. The precocious student who corrects the teacher or demonstrates a better way becomes a nuisance for those who hide behind such distinctions. Here the goal of institutional reproduction overshadows the goal of learning.
In my experience, the best teachers among us never cast off their student mantle because they can’t. The learning process is an eternal obsession that they must share with others. They excite our passions not for acquiring competency or expertise but for discovering those things we had never thought of before. The best teachers are forever looking to learn and discover especially when they are teaching.
Thank you, Chris, for being a student and a teacher.
The star trek reference made me thing. Other than the carving that takes place in this episode
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_the_Bough_Breaks_(Star_Trek:_The_Next_Generation)
was there any woodworking in Star Trek? You would think with all of planets looking like southern California that Kirk visited there would be a stout interstelar trade in west coast lumber.
Chris what more can I say that has not already been expressed in this blog. Other than you have been personally responsible days for me returning to my beginnings in woodcraft using hand tools. That is how I started in the 5th grade. My first shop class, they did’nt allow us to use machinery. And because of your blogs and videos on how to use these tools and what tools to use. I am a happy amateur. But I prefer to keep my pants up Thank You!
I won’t get into the poo throwing, but there is one thing worth noting.
Chris is a professional, a professional writer. A professional writer takes complex ideas and planes/whittles/shapes words to convey the message to the masses. What he chooses to write about is woodworking with a focus on hand tools (his passion, okay his second passion, beer maybe #1).
No one has ever listened to Chris because they thought he was a professional woodworker, they listen to him because he is a likable dude with a foundation of knowledge about the craft and he is EAGER to share it with everyone. In all of the items that Chris has written, he has never, EVER once said his way is the only way.
I for one, also hate Chris (JUST KIDDING), because I’m not as lucky as he is. To be doing what I love, and getting to enjoy the success that all his hard work has generated.
If I had to choose between Frank Klausz, THE SCHWARZ, or Rob Cosman as a teacher for cutting dovetails, I would choose Chris everyday of the week, and twice on Sunday. Not because I think he is the best at it, but because I think I would enjoy the class more with him up front.
Hate the game, not the playa homey…..
A professional woodworker needs to know the right way to do something. He doesn’t have the time or (usually) the inclination to find out why its the right way. A teacher, in order to teach well, has to. Thank you, Chris, for that inclination and for sharing your discoveries!
Wow!!! and/or Holy S–t! Mr Roberts, I don’t know who your are or what your beef is, but that came off like a ton of sour grapes!
Speaking for myself, over the past several years Chris has become my all-time favorite woodworking author. That’s because of the clarity with which he writes, the quirky humour, his passion for woodworking, his insatiable curiosity, and his corny choice of music for his videos. Most of my new and prized acquisitions have the name Schwarz on the spine, as well as one really outstanding one by Tolpin, with props to Joel Moscowitz as co-author of ‘The Joiner and Cabinetmaker’. These are the books I refer to most often and that I find most useful, lacking any recourse to a 7 year apprenticeship.
Chris’s work has had a significant impact on the industry too. Had he not deciphered the secret of the Moxon vise, those hundreds of us who have built or intend to build one would never have spent the money, nor would Jameel Abraham of Benchcrafted have gotten $150 of my money for the hardware. I’ve spent a small fortune on hand tools since reading his work, and enjoy my woodworking more than ever. I expect to spend more money with Benchcrafted to buy their Roubo kit, and the local lumberyard will make more money off of me purchasing the lumber for that and many more projects to come. I guess he’s had a significant impact on my wallet too! (No complaints here, Chris! Money is made for spending!).
Not one of us is perfect, so rather than dealing with the faults of others we should be more concerned about working on our own shortcomings. If you have a problem with what Chris said in his post, it would have been more productive to state what you feel the correct context to be without the snarkieness or the (inferred by myself) assumption that the quote was a slam against you. Had you not posted we would never have known who the quote referred to as Chris didn’t say.
I think the number of responses to this thread and the general tenor of them speak volumes. Do I think Chris is a woodworking god? Not a chance! Is he a professional woodworker? By the strict definition, definitely not since he doesn’t make his living making furniture. Do I think he’s a great teacher and writer? Abso-damn-lutely! From what I’ve been reading on other blogs, he’s also a good and valued friend to many whose opinions I have come to value.
Now whether you’re justified in your beef or not, I can’t and won’t judge. If there’s one thing I’ve learned about social media though it’s this: you want to be really careful about what you say and how you say it. Never, ever, write and post something while you’re angry. You’ll almost always regret it later. And you can’t unsay it.
Oh, I do love public discourse. It’s so well rounded, accepting of other’s opinions and above all, open to debate at all levels.
You’re making my point for me. I didn’t say you didn’t have a legitimate beef with what Chris said. I said your post came off like a ton of sour grapes and that you would have been better served by stating your point of view without the snarkieness. That’s all I’m going to say to you on the subject since your reply to me was also snarky. I’d rather spend my time on more productive pursuits.
Be well.
asdfjkl;
Is Mr. Roberts jeaeous?
So I stopped listening to Mr. Schwarz and listened only to Professional Woodworkers – I heard little.
I started listening to Mr. Schwarz again – want to keep learning,
thanks.
What flaming maroon said that?
Chris,
I’d like to comment but you’ve said not to listen to you making it impossible to leave a relevant reply.
That said, I glean from the title of this post (which I read and then promptly dismissed because you said not to listen to you) that your frustration stems from your lack of professional status. To that I say, sell something and get it over with. For me woodworking was continual strife in my efforts to improve my skills until I went pro. I struggled with getting my tools razor sharp quickly and efficiently. I had difficulties with highly figured woods tearing out whilst planing the surfaces readying them for finish. Even my joinery lacked the perfection I desired until I discovered the secret: a paycheck.
I saw professional woodworkers everywhere who no longer suffered from these afflictions. Truly a paycheck eliminates tear out, awkward designs, mis-cuts, ill-fitting joinery, drips, runs and other errors. Look around you. There is no furniture on the market that suffers from any of these ailments. Please sell something so that you can join the ranks of us who’ve gone beyond being merely ugly bags of mostly water (never knew you were a TNG fan) and achieve your full potential as a woodworker. That’s the entire reason I became a professional at the age of 17 thus avoiding all those years of toil and practice. If you would just sell something I can start listening to you again and possibly leave a relevant reply to your post.
As for teaching, you’re welcome at my school anytime as I have sufficient noise cancelling headphones for the entire class. At least Iron Hill Brewery isn’t far from the shop…
Chuck Bender
Still learning after over 30 years of full time woodworking.
I don’t care if a person is professional or not. I’ve learned a ton from Schwartz. So much so that whatever he says in the woodworking realm is pretty much gospel. I know lots of professionals in other disciplines that couldn’t teach their way out of a paper bag. Woodworking is no different. Some have it, some don’t, Schwartz has simple straight forward style I like. Who needs a pro?